It’s been an incredibly frustrating weekend for Liverpool fans. Firstly, we lose an incredibly controversial game against Stoke and then both City and United go on to grab another handful of goals to strengthen their respective positions as joint leaders. United now have 18 goals, whilst City have scored 15. Meanwhile, the Reds have managed just 6. With the chances we had against both Bolton and Stoke on Saturday though, we could’ve been up there near the top and with a much more impressive goal difference having had around 35 shots at goal over the course of both games combined.
But that’s all about ifs and buts and working out how best to get the ball in the net is something of a work in progress for what is essentially a new team. What we have seen in every game from them so far is improvements, particularly going forward; it will come. However, we can begin to make changes at the opposite end of the pitch that will bring immediate benefits and that means the phasing out of Jamie Carragher. There will be those amongst you reading this that will assume – as people like to do – that this is a knee-jerk reaction to Carragher’s poor decision making for the penalty Stoke won on Saturday.
This is an opinion I’ve held for at least 18 months though and I’ve already written on the subject several times in the past couple of years but, for me, Saturday was the final straw: a good performance made meaningless by an all too expected mistake from Jamie. That’s not to say we would’ve won (or, even drawn) the game if not for his error but we would’ve had a far greater chance of continuing with our game-plan which, at that point, was clearly working.
Against Bolton a few weeks ago Carragher’s poor judgement again tarnished what should’ve been a superb 3-nil win. Instead, the end of the match left a particularly sour taste after Carragher allowed Bolton to snatch a totally undeserved late goal. That means that 2 of the 3 league goals we’ve conceded so far this season are down to Carragher. The overriding theme of both is that he can be turned far too easily; he has always been slow and slightly cumbersome but with age, he has slowed even more and it is now starting to negatively affect our performances.
While I admire his tenacity and his ability to put in an extra 15% when other players have already switched off (CL Final 2005 a prime example), this is no longer enough to warrant him a place in the team. When Sami Hyypia was starting to show signs of winding down and his body was no longer able to keep up with his brain, he was unceremoniously stuck on the bench and Agger stepped up. Now, I think it’s time for Carragher to take his place on the bench and allow Skrtel and Agger an opportunity to form a partnership, with Coates also given a chance to stake his claim because if you build something on crumbling foundations it’s always going to fall down, as we found against Stoke on Saturday when, after a strong start all of our hard work and preparation was undone by a characteristic mistake from the stand-in captain.
Continue reading to page 2 of post
And who do we replace him with? Kelly? Crocked again, Coates? Too young and inexperienced, Johnson? Crocked again, Agger how long before he’s injured again? Skirtl? That’s a joke, Flanagan? Too young, Robinson? Too young. Transfer window is closed, any other bright ideas?
Coates is your answer mate, Phil jones :S Smalling and Cleverly….its about giving them responsibility and chances n now ppl r talkin like celverly wil repalce scholes,
COATES is quite fantastic, hed play, other than that, stop making generalizations like (TOO YOUNG) n so wont work….
Farjad is right. This is where the skill and experience of the manager comes in. It pains me to say this but A.F of Manure has this in abundance and the results shows. His new fledglings are competing with M.City and Chelski, teams of star players.
We have Coates and what happen to Danny Wilson, why are we not bedding him in?
Carra had been a liability for the last 2 seasons and i disagree with KD. It was an outright penalty, it just that this time he did not get away with it unlike in the past. Anyway if Henderson and C.Adams (overated players bought by KD) put away half of those chances, we would be talking about the 3 points and not Carra’s mistake like the Bolton game.
I respect Carra’s loyalty and winning mentality ut he had to admit that he just can’t cope anymore (even with a second rate striker) and it’s time he goes with some dignity intact.
@Bill: Carragher? Too old. Carragher? Too technically limited. Carragher? Too slow. Carragher? Too incompetent. Carragher? Too much of a hoofer. Carragher? Too much shouting and finger pointing. So what if the transfer window is closed. Do we persist with this so-called-bright-idea, but in reality a most-definitely-over-the-hill player named Jamie Carragher?
LFC have conceded 2 out of 3 goals in the league becoz of Carras mistake. should continue coaching role that wud benefit our youngsters. pace n reflexes are huge negatives now and coates shud be preferred.
Ive xplained that in my article Yesterday, heres a link to that
I seem to remember at the start of last season it took Carra about five games to get fit and he looked like a player being carried by those around him. but once fit again, he put in some masterful performances. last year he actually managed to keep rooney and his nemesis drogba well and truly quiet. the problem comes when he doesn’t play. as good as agger and skirtl can be, neither of them are great at leading the back four or gwtting the best out of the other. that’s something that carra has in abundance. thise around him feed of his confidence, his positional play, his instructions. he is almost irreplacable becausw of his drive and desire to win. i can see flaws creeping into his game but he has adapted, as all great players do
cos hes past hes good now he need let young players to replace him and no more mistake
coates, you say he’s 2 young and inexperienced, look at the united cunts, coates is bette than them, w all no he is, he won young player of the tournement at copa america, what has joans and smlling wn are done fuck all, coates will be amazing when he starts playing, kk sad he is not goin to rush him but i think he’ll get playing time against spurs thn start the next game
u right carl i agree with ya mate
It is no use pinning blame on one player. The team could not break down the Stoke defence. I am more worried about Carroll than Jamie. Carroll seems so out of place with the new style of play. Just standing on the penalty spot waiting for the ball to be crossed is useless and 10 years out of date. The only thing going for us right now is Suarez. Everything else is mediocre.
The point on Carroll is spot on, but KD paid 35 mill for him and are forced to play him eventhough we all know he is crap.
Potential is one thing, living up to it is another. There are tons of players out there with better potential, do the cost as much?
Admittedly, we bought a £35 million donkey in Andy Carroll.
As i have been saying for quite some time…Carra is getting old. In past 2 seasons he made some terrible mistakes, flops and needless penalties,his reactions are slower and sometimes to late, which had influenced the score of lots of important games. With all my respect for a Liverpool legend, and his determination and motivation, he will have to step down and be replaced with some of the younger guys. As long as this is postponed the harder will be to do it without damaging the image of a great player with the heart of a warrior.
One more thing…creating opportunities and have a lots of shoots on the goal in one and, and bad results at the other, means that we need fire power. At least one more class forward to get back on the top.
hoofing long balls up the field to nobody is getting really anoying too
I don’t if it is wise to let carragher step down from 1st team. But i think letting coates replace carra would be the best option. Just don’t let coates ruin like Danny wilson. Not enough experience.
big respect for carra, but time has come to give the young lads their taste of the premier league.. carra is a real liability to us when it comes to speed and technical ability.. its clear that it should be skrtel or even coates (maybe for the years to come)who should replace that emblematic figure of LFC.. however, i have entire faith in KD.. he knows what he’s doing, i hope so..
kk should do away with sentiment and make use of his young players and be more positive rather than thinking of player pedegre.let kk base his choice on the most fit and not name or price e.g carra,carroll
I think Daglish made mistake in insisting on Cara. Such big much woud have looked for young and tall defenders like Coats. After all, why did he bought it. I think favoring UK players is dangerious for the team. He has to learn from Ferguson principles. Otherwise, it is not late that we lose Suarez with depressed results.
Of course, Stock is harder than Hotspur now, because they are best defending side. Hotspur is on the otherhand, an attacking side with best players and that is best Christmas for Suarez compensation.
Carra iz too old 4 my likeing,why nt put coates in.look at how man u did with Gary nevile, and madrid 2 Raul,man city 2 dunne.why nt keep away the old legs and conced less.kk.am a liverpool fan bt must say u are afraid. of ur players.play those who are fit and are in foam nt some old quakes ie jamie carragher and younge over-rated,over paid.over priced.just fire that dull asst captain.he iz supose 2 be a classroom teacher and nt a football maniac.ha ha
Fire him fire him fire him fire him him caragher old fool
wat’s suprisin me is dat all u guys that say kk need to get rid of carra seem to think ur better managers than kk? how about havin some faith in our king. im sure he sees thing we dont!
At last, a voice of sanity amongst all those feckin idiots above who know zilch about football but think that they know more than experienced managers and coaches
Not one of them has seen Coates play in UK. They are the same ones that would think Forlan was crap when he played for the scum but would now be saying we sghould get someone like Forlan. Do they not know Coates is very young and hasn’t palyed outside Uruguay, but suddenly this feela isn’t going to make any mistakes unlike the vastly experienced Carra
This club doesn’t need supporters like these, they are feckin idiots and probably still in their teens
All the”fecking idiots above” have right to express their opinion which can be opposite of yours, Ged. No one from the people above didn’t claimed that they are experts or better than the coaches and experts. As supporters of the club, some of them i am sure longer and more devoted than you, they just make comments of an article posted. As you may forget first come the club and than any person, player,coach or stuff member. So every thing can be open for discussion and people can express their feelings and idea’s.
I am convinced that King Kenny knows the best and he have my unconditional support.
In one thing you are right, we don’t need supporters like thees, or like you to be precised. Share your idea’s, if you have one, but don’t insult anyone else. Like this you sound like some spoiled brat who is getting mad when he think he knows the best and some one have different opinion than his expert view,some teenager who doesn’t know anything about real support for the club. YNWA
bringing it back to the point, Carra is slower than he was, we are playing a more attacking style which may be leaving him too exposed, how Kenny resolves this depends on how he see’s the options, Coates may or may not be the answer, 2 things i think might contribute, firstly danny agger looks very solid, so worrying about if and when he gets injured is pointless, which for me leaves a lot of options re the center back position. 2 nd has it occured to anyone that Kenny recognises Carra’s roll as a leader (he is acting captain after all) I know your all rushing to suggest other captains, but maybe any change at the back will follow Stevie’s return to the first team, any other action would demote Carra from the vice captains roll; one that if he is to progress within the background of the club, he should probably be left with for now.
I can surez in madrid,barton in liverpool,carroll in hull city.fagan in liverpool and i can c tony pulis as the new manager
I can c u dont no wat the feck u r talkin bout
Its not the voice of sanity , its a voice of one of those people who are just blinded by things, IN kenny we trust YES we say that coz we know his capabilities, BUT he is a human, he can make mistakes as well,
Please its better for people to give logical opinions then slating others opinion and coming up and saying that (ARE YOU better manager than Kenny)
I suppose you’re right I shouldn’t be slating others opinions, but in the same breathe aren’t you slating my opinion? And it makes no sense asking me ”ARE YOU better than manager than Kenny” beacause my whole point is that we’re not. Btw I’m NOT really impressed by YOUR use of capital letters.
@farjad. kk sees these guys playing almost everyday in training, don’t you think in that time kk can spot if someone is out of there depth or not? joe cole is an example of this, great reputation but kk saw he wasn’t good enough.
mate ur opinions is based on “THINK” and others opinions are based on what they are watching at the games, so i thot its better to argue on that instead of sayin that basicaly our opinions are senseless coz we aint better manager then kenny and what he thinks and watches….
Now mate it will be crime to say that skrtel agger or caotes are better than carra but soon they will be better options…m carras fan, his tackles positioning and leadership are positives and diminshing reflexes and pace and lack of technical abilities are the negatives….with his growin age the errors are increasing and negatvies are coming up more than the positives…
i still believe he can be productive but for how long?? and i see ur point about kenny watching him oin training, but lets see it this way, when u ave quality depth, underperforming leads to bench, carra is responsible for conceding 2 out of 3 goals in the league, he might have had decent games but one mistakes changes the whole outcome of the game and ruins the stats..
Perhaps he wont be benched for tottenham but suposedly he makes another mistake which wil make it 3 games in a row, should he be benched then?? Other reasons ive mentioned above n also in the article
Is it Time to Bench Jamie Carragher
scums cleverly 22, jones 19 smalling 21, they are shining right…Coates is better than jones, and should be given responsibility….
n sorry if u felt that the capital letters are sounding like “shouting or being rude” i just use them coz there aint any bold letters on here
Na man I was just pulling your leg with the capital letters thing, and what I’ve read about Coates is that apparently he’s slow which means he could be a liablity because kk plays an offside trap quite high up the pitch, I think that might be the one of the reasons why he hasn’t plated yet.
mate then again why did kenny buy him at first place :D, hes not the fastest but defo not slow…n its not the case of him being slow, it was just the first match, keny would have introduced him if we were in winning position, we were losing thats why he opted for attacking options, i hope we see him against Tottenham…
had a good look at Coates, admittedly coverage of south american football is patchy, but from what i can see he has no problem with pace, big guy big strides so looks slower than he really is, besides first yard is in the head and he seems to read situations very well.
we give away three goals this season two them was a cause of our vice captain, thats 2/3 i think is better to realise now than later. Carra time is gone bring in Coates he is a good player he will learn very fast.
Kenny will allow Carra to make 8 appearances so that he gets the winners medal at the end of the season,,,, 🙂
If there is one problem with us Lfc fans, its dat we are too fu*king sentimental for my liking and mostly to our own detriment.
Carra is a legend, so wot?? the fact that he’s still on a contract is enough respect for his sacrifices. u dont have to be a genius to see that the man shouldn’t be playin week in week out. u lot would talk about his experience, anticipation and command of the backline, but u’ll choose to ignore his total lack of pace n agility, inability to keep the ball on the ground and vulnerability in the air. Am not talking about the last two matches, am talking about the last 2-3 seasons. Am not out to attack Carra and am not sayin he should be kicked out, am sayin he should be eased out of the startin 11 slowly. If we keep him (and I expect we will) on contract till he retires, then thats enough to repay his ‘loyalty and sacrifices’. Personally, I was hoping we’ld buy a solid proven defender who’ld walk straight into the startin lineup. admittedly, I have not seen Coates in action, I just hope he’s as good as they say he is.
Another culprit is Dirk ‘work ethic without brilliance’ Kuyt. I still have’nt concluded who is the slowest btw Carra, Kuyt and Adam. most will sing on and on about his work ethic and defensive attributes but will fail to mention that he lacks ALL the attributes of a modern day winger. Pace? crossing? dribbling? trickery? To put it short, Kuyt is neither a good winger nor striker.
U might accuse me of slating players who give their all to our club but thats not the case. am just using these 2 examples to express wot most (if not all) of u must have thought about at 1 point or the other but for whatever reason prefer to deny it or ignore, or beautify it by using words such as ‘committed’, ‘loyal’, ‘hardworking’.
Am not sayin we should start criticizing every player who is not delivering the goods. am just sayin we should start being objective and not so fu*king romantic about every thing. I have seen times when some1 (rightly) questions a wrong decision by the coach, then sum1 pops the stupid question ……’do u know more than Kenny?’ Since wen do fans just shut up and act like they have a computerized football machine of a manager who cant make a mistake? hmmm
The management have said that they will continue to invest in the team so I say this (and I stand to be corrected) that if we invest in the team further, players like Carra and Kuyt should be no more than squad players in the near future.
Lest I forget, u Carroll obsessors should wait till the end of the season after he has gotten a run of games before running ur mouths. It’s gettin really borin.
Agree with most of this Carroll has to be given time, and how we use him is down to the manager. Just one point though, most of the points being made here are that its time for Carra to step down, so not too many sentimentalists getting in the way… Favourite quote on this came from Ian St John, he was asked about when he finished at Liverpool, he said he was called into Shankly’s office, and Shankly said ” err, Ian its been great” shook his hand and that was that, St John never played for the first team again.
looks like there are still things we can learn from the great man eh.
I think some players deserve a bit more leeway.carra has been the heart of liverpool’s defence for a decade,an absolute legend.and the type of man he is,i think he will be the 1st to admit it when he feels he is not upto it.till then,lets support the great man.JAMIE CARRAGHER-YOU’LL NEVER WALK ALONE..
i don’t rate jamie very high. and kuyt too. been watching jamie years & years, for me he’s one of the defenders in BPL that gave away penalty too often & one that put goals into his own net quite often as well. as for kuyt, he needs 10 chances to put in 2 goals. that’s not good for our standard if we want to catch up with other leading team !